The fact that the only solution you see is "punishment" is exactly the problem. No reasonable punishment will stop these crimes. Period. And unreasonable punishments, like locking a human in a cage without rehabilitation for years of their life, only make the problem worse and cost us a ridiculous amount of money (and humanity).
So maybe take a step back, or five, and think about the causes of petty crimes and why they happen here more than other nations.
>The fact that the only solution you see is "punishment" is exactly the problem. No reasonable punishment will stop these crimes. Period.
Reasonableness can be debated. That these crimes are unstoppable less so; not only is any crime stoppable, if stoppable means reducing the yearly instances of it. It's disproven because the crime numbers have gone up since these policies have been implemented and we've reduced incarceration rates. It's a correlation that you can't ignore.
Your humanitarian argument is absolutely legitimate, how we deal with people who steal, often out of necessity due to addiction, mental illness, or other desperation. It's hard to say that punishment is always an inhumane option though. We can't run a society and dense cities without an enforcement of some order, since that concerns the other 99% who aren't committing these crimes. If pharmacies close and parks are unusable, everyone suffers.
A big cause of petty crimes (and more serious ones) is people growing up among criminals and seeing them not face harsh consequences. The reality experienced by a group of people shapes their mores over time.
Nah, locking them up is cheaper than leaving them out. Yes, it may cost a lot but what do you think the societal cost is of beating up CVS employees until they close another store? What do you think the neighbors would want?
> locking a human in a cage without rehabilitation for years of their life
A human who isn't worth letting out even if it were safe to do so. Net positive to society. I'd rather imprison one person than sentence another to a mugging or rape. The CVS employees have rights too.
> make the problem worse and cost us a ridiculous amount of money (and humanity)
Explain the humanity loss to someone mugged or raped by a repeat offender.
> why they happen here more than other nations
Why are more rapes reported in Sweden than India? Because more rapes happen, or more rapes are reported? In many countries if you tried to shoplift you'd simply be beaten and thrown out. In the USA police are called and a report is written.
As for which nation is safer, it depends if you're a criminal or not.
Punishment is about desert, rooted in morality. A sin/crime/misdeed just definitionally deserves punishment.
Read The Humanitarian Theory of Punishment by CS Lewis [1].
The other position is that humans need to be cured of their problems. At which point the "humanitarians" who arbitrarily decide these things, basically will endlessly torture people into conformance. They medicalize justice. With the permission of their own conscience, they will cure people of things they may not even regard as a state of disease. Of course these "diseases" are a subjective matter. What some people regard as unpleasant ways to live, others don't.
Can't even argue with someone who thinks like this. But in an ideal situation, you would get to live in a city with no prosecution for theft and I get to live somewhere with harsh punishment for theft.
The problem is I have to live under the mayors you vote for because there's a few more of you than me.
max shoplifting penalty in nyc is a year and thats for repeat offenders. its mostly fines. you are right putting people in prison for years for shoplifting is bad. it doesnt really happen
So maybe take a step back, or five, and think about the causes of petty crimes and why they happen here more than other nations.