HN2new | past | comments | ask | show | jobs | submitlogin

> One would never refer to law school or medical school as "vocational".

Sure you would. They are 100% vocational schools. Their cost, acceptance rates, time commitment, and difficulty level may be higher than other vocational schools, but that doesn't change what they are -- 100% focused on giving you the knowledge and skills to do a specific job.



Law schools (or at least the top 20 school that I went to) are definitely not 100% focused on teaching you the vocation of being an attorney.

Hell, they aren't even focused on teaching you to pass the bar, which is why most people pay for separate cram schools.


Yet, going to law school is a pre-requisite for becoming the vocation of a lawyer.

Arguably, "a school one must go to in order to practice a vocation" can be referred to as a "vocational school." I understand that vocational schools are often thought to be purely practical and not theoretical, but I think this definition does a disservice to the reality of entering certain vocations.


No, it is not a pre-requisite. At least in the U.S., several states still allow you to pass the bar and become a licensed attorney without going to law school.


That's the point - they are, but are not referred as such.


They are in fact called "professional schools" -- this captures what both of you are saying.


They are actually called "professional" schools, but yeah it's a euphemism that means the same thing.


Well then where are all the "vocational" CS programs at universities?


Canada has ‘software engineering’ degrees which are essentially vocational CS degrees.


To add to this, Canadian Universities also have co-op programs.

You don't have to have an engineering degree to get a co-op job. The student gets paid well over minimum wage (and learns on the job) and the employers get financial incentives from the gov't to hire students. Its win-win for both the student and the employer.


Software Engineering at Canadian universities does not contain a dramatically different level of vocational training (with the exception of Waterloo).

Co-op programs are optional, and take place in the summer or in a gap year. The affiliation of companies hosting co-ops is loose, and the schools charge large fees for participating in these programs (with the exception of Waterloo).

Speaking from personal experience, results may vary.


Which Canadian schools have software engineering degrees which are vocational?

Note that my degree is from a well-reputed Canadian school that has a "software engineering specialization", and as far as I can tell (though I did not take it) that specialization is indistinguishable from the main CS curriculum, and is not valid vocational training.


Medical and Law schools are postgraduate.


In some places. In Ireland, law is a normal undergraduate degree with some extra vocational training after you graduate. Medicine is an undergraduate (5 year) programme, during which quite a lot is vocational - students spend multiple months in hospitals during that period, and when they graduate they are still considered as training.


Coding Boot camps


... which are not at universities.


And will also not prepare you for a job in computer science.


They might prepare you for an intro-level job in software development though, if you actually continue learning things and honing your skills after completing them.


For what it's worth, these bootcamps are the current "trade schools" for software jobs where the barrier to entry is lower. They're accelerated programs that use job placement as a strong selling point.

It's almost like they rose from the death of many for-profit technical schools (DeVry, WestWood et al.) and took their ecological niche. But in contrast to bootcamps, these for-profit schools were too big, slow, and ineffective.


in the business college.




Guidelines | FAQ | Lists | API | Security | Legal | Apply to YC | Contact

Search: